Utes ready for fall camp to start
And so am I.
Utah football kicks off fall camp today and that pretty much means we're in the final lap of the offseason. You can already hear the band playing Utah Man.
Soon, Rice-Eccles Stadium will be filled with red-clad Ute fans cheerin' on Utah in their inaugural Pac-12 season.
I can't wait.
The U, in anticipation for the start to camp, has released its roster for the year and Po'u Palelei is listed.
Benji Kemoeatu, however, is not. And, as much as we hoped he would find his way onto the field this year, he ain't.
Kemoeatu faced similar issues at West Virginia, so it isn't a surprise. The guy is as elusive as D. B. Cooper. Also listed on the roster are Shawn Asiata and Tauni Vakapuna, so that's good news.
Beyond just who's on it, the first thing I noticed is how few seniors Utah really has. Only fifteen of 105 players listed are ending their careers this winter.
That's a spectacular number and means the Utes could be set for the next few years. As much as we look at 2011 being a big year, 2012 looms as potentially the biggest.
Of course, a lot can change - players can leave and the team can regress greatly.
But for now, the future is looking mighty good.
Some pre-camp links...
Pac-12 move paying off for Utah recruiting - CBSSports.com
Red roundup: Blaine Fowler chimes in on Wynn, Utes | Deseret News
Engaging Whittingham, Utah fired up over Pac-12 adventure - NCAA Football - CBSSports.com
ksl.com - 3 areas of focus for the Utes entering fall camp
Utah Utes Preview #31 on College Football Countdown | LostLettermen.com
O-lineman Stevens will have a new role for Utes in 2011 | U of U Sports | The Salt Lake Tribune
Utah football: New league, same attitude for Whittingham’s Utes | The Salt Lake Tribune
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Great news about Po'u
I saw the 105 roster posted on Twitter last night and was glad to see that. Benji being left off was really sad but almost expected at this point. Too bad.
Wynn
Is the issue. When they started him we all said “4 year starter would be sweet” but he has been pouded into mediocrity twice. I am most worried about the QB spot. We’ve no one sturdy under center, and no decent looking backup as yet. Have we recruited anyone worthy? Perhaps, but I bet they are 1 to 2 years out on usefulness.
Icky, icky, icky.
"Gentlemen, it is better to have died as a small boy than to fumble this football."--John Heisman
i am cautiously optimistic on wynn
I think in the pro style system, he will be subject to fewer hits. That is assuming that the line stays healthy and does its job. I think that we will see more of Jordan’s strengths this year with that.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 4, 2011 8:30 AM MDT up reply actions
Wynn
I posted about Wynn’s stats in another discussion… he’s been statistically as good as Matt Barkley, and he’s played stiffer or as-stiff defenses.
by Joseph Silverzweig on Aug 4, 2011 10:07 AM MDT up reply actions
Disagree...
I’m not ready to give up on Wynn due to two games.
And I think it’s a bit foolish to have that attitude. If he does spend this entire season struggling due to injury, I guess I can see your point, but I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because, even considering what happened last year, he’s still got an impressive record.
1-0 in bowl games
1-1 against BYU
11-4 as a starter
Compare that to Brian Johnson before his 2008 season:
1-0 in bowl games
0-1 against BYU
13-7*
*I gave Johnson the Oregon State & New Mexico losses in ’07 & ’05 respectively because he started, did not count AFA, UCLA, UNLV, BYU & Georgia Tech that year (2-3) due to his not playing/not starting.
So, let’s see how he does this year. Johnson was 5-5 his sophomore year and that includes awful losses to San Diego State (at home), CSU and UNC.
If, next year, we’re questioning whether Wynn has it, you’re probably right. But a good number of quarterbacks struggle in their sophomore season. I’m willing to see how Wynn does as a junior and hopefully it means good things as a senior.
Agree Completely
People act like Wynn was the worst QB to ever don a Ute uniform last year. Truth be told, even while slumping, he put up good numbers.
And considering he injured his shoulder against Iowa State, that makes it all the better.
I realize it’s hard to follow the Legend of Brian Johnson, but people need to remember that Brian Johnson wasn’t Brian Johnson until a few games into 2008.
even in 2008.....
Brian Johnson made me cringe more often than not. His best attribute was that he brought it when it mattered.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 4, 2011 2:06 PM MDT up reply actions
Ice Water in His Veins . . .
If anyone found my snowboarding gloves after storming the field following the 2004 TDS game, I want them back!
Agreed.
Brian Johnson was not God, but by his senior season he simply found ways to win the game.
Dolphins and sharks are natural enemies. Dolphins are like, "Quit eating us," and sharks are like, "Stop smiling all the time, you morons."
Sort-of-daily sort-of-funny sort-of-thoughts at danoftheday.com
Good Points
I haven’t been sold on Wynn just yet, but this helps me be a bit optimistic.
If anyone found my snowboarding gloves after storming the field following the 2004 TDS game, I want them back!
Well . . .
I am not giving up on him, but one thing left out of the analysis is that Wynn has had a helluva lot more talent around him than Johnsosn did. Saddling Johnson with the OSU loss, he played about 5 minutes, tops, is also not really sporting. Skews the data you know.
"Gentlemen, it is better to have died as a small boy than to fumble this football."--John Heisman
nice pick up on the 15 seniors
the future of utah football is VERY bright.
If I remember right, Po’u was on the roster last year. I remember going “380 pounds?!?!?!?!?! Wow……..” Hopefully, he actuall qualifies. Haven’t heard anything official.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
Pretty Sure Po'u didn't even join until March
He Originally commited to ASU before going the JC route the past few years. Didn’t commit till March.
I suppose its niether here nor there...
but here is the link to the 2010 roster, with po’u on it.
http://utahutes.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/archive/2010-11-roster.html
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 4, 2011 9:19 AM MDT up reply actions
someone asked yesterday about nai fotu
according to Dirk, Nai has been cleared to practice during camp, but as of yet has not been cleared to play in the games.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
The Offense
More than anything, I’m curious what our offense looks like. The phrases “pro-style” and “downhill run game” to me conjure up nightmares of the Ron McBride era, running it up the gut almost exclusively. But it’s not like Norm Chow’s a slouch when it comes to the passing game. And I’ve heard they’re going to retain some of the spread. Does that mean we’ll see an empty backfield and five wide occasionally?
Whatever offense they put on the field this year, I’d bet my life it fares better in big games than what we saw against TCU, Notre Dame, and Boise St.
More Under Center, More TE, No Zone Read
That’s going to be the major differences. It’ll be run first, but truthfully the spread we ran was also supposed to be run first.
Mostly it’ll be Under Center, With TE Utilisation, and I Formation instead of Zone Read on the running plays, which will put more of an emphasis on play action.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see just as much passing. Although it’ll be more 7-15 yard plays, and maybe not quite as many deep 20+ yard plays.
Then again Ty Detmer, Carson Palmer, Matt Leinart, Philip Rivers all were able to rack up numbers under Chow.
McBride is an interesting case...
Because his offenses, at least during his early days at Utah, were not conservative and certainly not exclusive to the ground.
They were more what you’d expect from a pro-style team: a lot of plays through the air, but the running game still plays an active role.
I was re-watching the ‘93 BYU game and was just in awe at what our offense did back then. You’ll remember Utah won that game 34-31, in regulation, on a last-minute field goal. It was certainly a high-scoring affair.
Fun fact: Mike McCoy threw for 462 yards that day.
So, yeah, there was definitely something different in the early days of McBride’s era than what we later came to expect after ‘94. I don’t know if he was changed by the ‘94 season, the fact they came so close to perfection and blew it in two games, but after that, Utah’s offense became less an offensive threat and more built around the defense.
Case in point, look at PPG Utah averaged under McBride by year:
1992: 26.7 – 30th in the country
1993: 30.5 – 25th in the country
1994: 35.5 – 7th in the country
1995: 26.9 – 41st in the country
1996: 26.1 – 52nd in the country
1997: 23.0 – 65th in the country
1998: 30.8 – 30th in the country
1999: 31.7 – 21st in the country
2000: 21.3 – 85th in the country
2001: 27.4 – 52nd in the country
2002: 22.6 – 89th in the country
Outside a short window between ‘98 and ’99, Utah’s offense was pretty crappy from 1995-2002. Like I said, it goes back to that ’94 season. Maybe it was the lack of real good quarterbacks like McCoy or McBride becoming increasingly cautious (remember how superstitious he was in those final years?) – whatever the reason, the offense looked good in his first few seasons and crashed and burned toward the end.
I’m not concerned that will happen with Chow. He’s not the type of OC to run, run, pass, punt like McBride’s OC’s became at the end of his stay here (like, as I’m sure you all remember, Tommy Lee).
We lost Rick Rasnick after the '94 season.
Rasnick left to be the head coach at Eastern Michigan. He disappeared after that gig.
Rasnick was the only OC under McBride that passed the ball very much. Maybe McBride was completely inept when it came to hiring OCs. Or maybe, as a former Offensive Line coach, he really just wanted to pound the ball. I like your superstition theory too. But Tommy Lee and Craig Ver Steeg almost always ran the ball on first down.
That ’99 team had no business only finishing tied for a MWC championship. With Steve Smith at receiver and Mike Anderson at running back, that team should have been able to put up more than 31.7 points a game when you consider the competition that year.
Good point...
I hadn’t thought about Rasnick leaving being the major reason.
I do think it is all the above. Fred Graves was before Lee, I believe, after Rasnick and his offenses weren’t great, either. So we had three OCs in a row that pretty much ran the exact same offense.
Do you remember in 2000 when the Utes briefly hired Rob Spence as their OC? Spence pulled out shortly after, citing family issues, but I think much of it had to do with the fact he wanted to open the offense up and McBride essentially said no.
Spence would go on to run the high-powered Toledo offense from ‘01-’04, where they averaged 34, 35, 32 and 33 PPG.
He then ran Clemson’s offense until 2008 and is now the WR coach at Temple.
Certainly McBride’s musical chairs of OCs after Rasnick left didn’t help, but even with the changes, from Graves to Ver Steeg, the offense looked the same every single season.
No, I don't remember the Rob Spence episode.
But it makes sense that he didn’t see eye-to-eye with McBride’s philosophy. After 3 straight OCs ran the exact same offense, it wasn’t hard to figure out what the problem was. I thank McBride for resurrecting the program, but he had taken the program as far as he was capable.
another thing to keep in mind
(and im responding to this thread in general)
we had some jokes for QBs in those days. Darnell Arceaneaux beat BYU as a freshman and then never got to the next level. TD Croshaw had his moments but was extremely mediocre. Lance Rice made me want to throw my TV out the window.
Jordan Wynn is far superior to those guys, even when injured. That will help a lot.
As far as downhill running goes, its not the most exciting football in the world, but it can work. Remember the BYU game in 2002? Brandon Warfield kept crashing into that line time after time, think he had 40 carries. At first, BYU was able to keep him under control. But he wore them down and eventually they were just too tired to bring him down. Obviously, no one should carry the ball that much ever, let alone every week, but the point is the same. It wears the defense out to have some big guy come crashing through a bunch.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 5, 2011 9:39 AM MDT up reply actions
I don't know if we should be using the '02 game as an example of how to do something...
haha
That game was awful. Utah only won because the Cougars were terrible that season. One of the least satisfying Holy Wars in recent memory.
Had Utah played any other team that day and they probably lose by double-digits.
That’s the problem with that offense. It can certainly overpower bad and average defenses, but when you go up against legitimately great d-lines, you’re done. Toast. Finished.
So hopefully we’re not running, running, passing and punting our way to an anemic offense this season. We shouldn’t of course, because, as you said, we have a good quarterback under center. So…
run, run, pass, punt
still gives me nightmares.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 8, 2011 11:40 AM MDT up reply actions
I agree with that,
but why wasn’t McBride or his OCs able to get a serviceable quarterback for 8 years? McCoy was a good college quarterback, but none of the others even approached his ability.
And then there’s the fact that McBride preferred Lance Rice over Brett Elliott. McBride just preferred the “game manager” type quarterback over anyone with talent. So I agree with your quarterback point, but the blame for that problem still belongs at the feet of McBride.
To tell you the truth, he did get good quarterbacks...
You said it in your post.
McBride recruited both Brett Elliott and ALEX SMITH. Remember when he burned Alex Smith’s redshirt against SDSU in his final season because he was desperate for any traction and then ended up playing him only marginally?
Ugh. The more I think of how the McBride era ended, the more I get frustrated. I know that sounds terrible with all he did for Utah football, but dammit we could have been sooo much better in the 90s than we actually were.
And you know what? I think you can tie it right back to Rasnick leaving.
Think of it this way: Lance Rice was starting ahead of Brett Elliott and Alex Smith...
Something is wrong with that picture.
Yeah it does make me wonder...
Maybe we had someone on the roster who was much better than Darnell Arceneaux, but he was left riding the bench for an indecipherable reason.
I’m still mad about that ’99 team. It had another good Whittingham defense, a future NFL Rookie of the Year running the ball in Mike Anderson, and a future NFL all-pro receiver in Steve Smith, but no quarterback to get him the ball. Such a wasted opportunity.
'99 should have been a BCS busting season...
That team was so much better than 9-3. I know 9-3 is pretty good (especially for McBride), but with that schedule, 9-3 is about the lowest they should have finished.
But two things really kept that from being a fantastic season: losing to BSU before they were cool (Whitt’s defense held the Broncos to 26 points…at home…the second fewest they scored at home all season) and still not figuring out how to beat CSU. And while CSU was good in ‘99, they weren’t at their best. They finished 8-4 with some ugly losses in there. But, as they did every single year except once during the McBride-Lubick era, they beat Utah.
Oh and there was the typical McBride “WTF” loss to Wyoming, at home, that season.
And when I say BCS busting, I obviously mean positioned for it...
With their schedule, they wouldn’t have received a bid. Their best OOC win that year was against Wazzu, who finished the year 3-9.
Like I said in my above post, though, 9-3 was about the worst most teams could do with that schedule. The MWC was weak that year and also stung with parity (CSU, Utah and BYU all tied for the championship with a 5-2 record).
At 11-0, the Utes are playing in the Liberty Bowl that season, but still, it would have been fascinating to watch.
Excellent, Smithers . . .
As much as we look at 2011 being a big year, 2012 looms as potentially the biggest.
Hmmmmm . . . 2004, 2008, 2012? Maybe? Just maybe?
If anyone found my snowboarding gloves after storming the field following the 2004 TDS game, I want them back!
does ANYONE know
when the team is practicing today? No one has reported it and I want to know when to look for updates. Also, Sean, do you get a press credential to go to practices?
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 4, 2011 11:30 AM MDT reply actions
Practice is now over
The first practice is done. 1280 is giving updates. Utezone apparently has the first group.
Here’s a brief rundown of 1280’s update
Wynn looked good. Didn’t seem to have lost any velocity.
Keith McGill looked as advertised
Thretton receiving Majority of reps at #1.
Of course it was a non padded/non contact practice.
First reports from camp are coming in....
what I have gathered so far:
-Brian Blechen did not participate because a bee stung his lip (SL Trib)
-Anthony Denham also sat out with a sore hamstring (SL Trib)
-Thretton Palamo was getting the most reps with the 1’s when the media was allowed to watch (1280 the zone)
-Dexter Ransom looked VERY good. (1280 the zone)
when it comes to football, I only listen to 1280 (unless its jake and monson, BORING!) The guys at 1280 all played and have a better eye for the game than anyone else.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 4, 2011 12:36 PM MDT reply actions
Agree on 1280 as THE Football source
Although they are adamant that Thretton will not be the #1 RB come season.
my only problem with them....
besides Gordon Monson is Jan. I don’t know what Jan’s problem is, but he will never say anything positive about Utah. And he CONSTANTLY brings up pac-12 celebrations and tries to make fun of the Ute fan base. With Gunther, he gives an honest take about BYU, while still being a Ute homer. Jan just gives the negatives about Utah. No reaching across the aisle or anything. Jan grew up a Utes fan and I don’t know if he’s just bitter because Utah didn’t want him or what, but he sure is full of sour grapes.
No longer tweeting due to an overload of spam. please check out my blog sometime @ bigbenstechnicalfoul.blogspot.com for my thoughts on sports, religion, politics, family life and a host of other random stuff.
by BigBenSportsGuy on Aug 4, 2011 1:27 PM MDT up reply actions
Thanks for the updates, guys
Radio is often less convenient for us out-of-state folks, so it’s nice to get a run-down on what they’re saying.
Dolphins and sharks are natural enemies. Dolphins are like, "Quit eating us," and sharks are like, "Stop smiling all the time, you morons."
Sort-of-daily sort-of-funny sort-of-thoughts at danoftheday.com

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